Apres

We go over the History of Apres and their Well-known Gel-X system. How we think they fit best in the salon setting. And some new info on the company that you'll want to hear!

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Transcript

Kristin: 0:18

Welcome back to The C Curve Podcast. My name is Kristen. And my name is Erin. I almost said for The C Curve Podcast, but I guess it means the same thing. okay. And today our topic is something that somebody had requested when I had asked a while back if you had any requests and it was for Opry. I'm going to say Opry. There's Opry. I praise everyone has a weird ways to say it. There's no fucking way because it's been, we were talking for 20 minutes before recording.

Erin: 0:52

Yeah. And Kristen goes, okay, ready? I'm about to record. And I said, yep. Everybody's sleeping. It's been 30 seconds.

Kristin: 0:59

There's no,

Erin: 1:00

there's no way. I think it's because my voice changes when we talk, like when we're just like chilling I'm sitting on the couch. We're just having a conversation. My I'm, More level. So when we start recording, I'm like, Hey guys, like the telephone voice. And I think they know that. And they're like time to fuck shit up. They just, they're always going to make sure that they are permanent part of the podcast. I'm just a package deal. We are a package deal. You get the four dogs. Okay. Everybody's laying back down. So hopefully I saw that more. No more rude interruptions today. The contractor is working in the basement right now. So there could be a random bark or two. So sorry. You guys should be used to this by now. Honestly. Okay. Back to it. How do you say it? I think I say a prey operate. Wait, you say operate. And I say, I think I say a prey or when I first started doing I don't do jobs where, but when I did gel X. When I first started, I think I called it a praise. And then there was a way that somebody, one of my clients said it and I was like, that is not correct. I've

Kristin: 2:10

heard that before. I'm just not quite sure. So you might be screaming. I might be saying it wrong. You might be screaming at your phone, whatever you're listening to this on computer. The right way every time I say it wrong, I'm just going to apologize now. I'm not a thousand percent sure. I know that I asked him at a show one time and I've still forgotten. I think I hear people say it so many different ways so many times that I just don't even know.

Erin: 2:34

Yeah.

Kristin: 2:34

All right. A little bit of a background history. I already started in 2015, actually, so the fall of 2015, which was a lot earlier than I thought. But I guess it shows it takes a couple of years for a company to really pick up its stride.

Erin: 2:48

Yeah. Cause I did it in like 2000. 19. That's about

Kristin: 2:54

me. It was about 2017 when I started. I was at the Sacramento nail show with the salon that I had helped start in Berkeley, California. We went and I saw that and I remember thinking this just won't take off. This is not going to be like a big thing. Yeah, I was, I can admit that I was wrong but it started the founders were Carol Ma and Albie Chen in city of industry, California is what the city is called city of industry. I believe that's Southern California. I could be wrong. But yeah, so they started with their main product that everybody knows, which is gel X. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Which people in the beginning, I think I sometimes still hear people say it, but it's the misconception is that the tip itself was made out of gel. It's not. It's just a plastic tip. It's just a, yeah, it's just a really nice, gel is technically a cosmetic grade plastic anyways,

Erin: 3:51

but didn't they advertise it as that though?

Kristin: 3:53

It is a gel tip because you're adhering it with gel, but I do remember them saying it's not gel itself. The tip isn't.

Erin: 4:00

See, and when I read about it and stuff, I took it as

Kristin: 4:04

I know.

Erin: 4:05

The tip itself, like the thing you push down on the nail, is also gel.

Kristin: 4:11

Yes.

Erin: 4:11

But that makes sense though, because it would stick together if it, like you wouldn't be, oh no wait, I'm dumb, I'm thinking of dual form, so sorry. My brain is not in that space.

Kristin: 4:20

I hear it a lot from people, from clients and stuff but they were one of the first companies to create the idea of adhering these, like it's a very high grade tip. Like I'm not denying that it's not just like plastic. The way that they're created, that like curve the thickness ratios where they need to be, all of that is done really nicely. But adhering it with a soak off gel versus gluing them on the nail.

Erin: 4:45

This is really mind blowing information.

Kristin: 4:47

I agree. And then over time they started making different sizes, shapes, they have partnered. They've done little things like with different nail techs. They've done some really cute tips as well with them. Then they went into different

Erin: 5:02

colors. Yeah, they have the

Kristin: 5:05

bold colors. They have the ones with the cute cutouts. They have, they made bad

Erin: 5:09

about those. They made

Kristin: 5:11

extra small extra large all different shapes they've done the natural and then the like arch, the deep arch. Tips as well. They've done a lot with those, but then they moved on to they added airbrushing. And then yes, so they had their airbrush machine and then it wasn't there. It was air gel. It wasn't there. It wasn't there. Air gel isn't their company, but it's the product from, I believe, Japan that they were selling in on their website. And I think they were like one of the only American companies to be selling it. So that made it easily like accessible. And then they moved to nail polish. So they have their own nail polish, gel polish. The gel polishes look really beautiful. They just even launched some really pretty nude ones. The brush is very pretty. And then they also have it where it's angled for French. I don't know if that's still a thing, but. And then they made the. Operate tips that have the lines on it. So you can paint the perfect French's. I remember that came out to how cool, I don't know if they still have it, but I remember that was a thing at one point. Anyways, so they've done a lot of things. When the person commented, what we should talk about, all they wrote was Jellix, so I'm going to assume they want to want us to hear our point of view about actually having this product specifically operates Jellix system. In the salon, how we feel about it. And like maybe the pros and cons and stuff like that. Neither one of us use it, but we have,

Erin: 6:44

I used to, yeah, yes,

Kristin: 6:46

I did too. I have, hold on, please hold.

Erin: 6:50

If I say please hold to my husband, I never got rid of them. I

Kristin: 6:55

have so many boxes. I don't know why. I just keep them in case I decide I want to bring them back.

Erin: 7:02

Okay, but I kept mine for a really long time, just in case like somebody had a broken nail. Yeah. And then I would pull it out, but it was like rare that I would pull it out because I tried not to use them. But I kept a box for a long time.

Kristin: 7:15

Can I ask you why, cause you said keep in case they broke a nail, but you don't use them now. And can I ask your reasoning why?

Erin: 7:24

So like why I don't use them for broken nails or I don't use them in general. They don't offer the service. Both. Okay. I guess it's the same one.

Kristin: 7:33

Same question. Yeah.

Erin: 7:34

I have found better products to fix your broken nails now. And I didn't like, cause I do structured gel. I didn't like that the gel X was flat and then my structured gel had more of an apex. So it like, you could tell but I did gel X from probably mid 2019 to February of 2020. And I know it was February because I went to Arizona and took Hillary Don Herrera and Candace Greene's Luminary and Erica's e file class. And Structured Gel literally changed my life. I do GelX. I had a lot of clients that wanted extensions. Or let me take that back. I had a few clients that wanted the extension, but a lot of my clients wanted the gel X and then they had me clip it down to what their natural nail was anyway. And I was, so when I found structure gel, I was like this is dumb, like, why wouldn't I do this instead of Gillette? But what I found with Gillette because I wasn't educated well on it was because I didn't file out underneath that tip

Kristin: 8:36

of their

Erin: 8:36

natural nail. I had so much lifting. I had one client specifically that banged her hand on something or hit it on something really hard and the product lifted in the center. And knew it had lifted, but didn't come back or tell me for six weeks. So you can imagine what was festering under there. That was my first experience with grannies. And I was like, ready to quit my job. I was like, I'm throwing this career away. Goodbye. Like I was so fucking scared. It was awful. It was so awful. And I didn't know what to do. I was like, oh my God. And she was so nasty. Cause I wouldn't put products back over it. Because it was just, it was like in her nail bed. Like it was, bad because we like shouldn't take the product off. But I did gel X for a while and really liked it. My clients loved it. Like I got, I felt like my speed was quicker because you just, so much it down and go, but you have to like the stress of trying to get all the bubbles out because especially after that green situation, I was like triple dehydrating nail plates. And I was like so scared of lifting. But I got to do really fun art and clients that wanted longer nails had it. But once I found structured gel and sounds that people's nails would not break with it. Like their natural nail wouldn't. flake off like it would with. Regular gel. Cause there's no structure there. So your nail bends. I just was like, I remember being on the plane back from the class and I restructured my whole website. So I don't have an email saying I wasn't doing structured gel anymore. And I had a client that was like, or that I wasn't doing gel X anymore. And I had a client that was like, please don't do this. And I'm like, I promise you if you hate this, I'll give you your money back. I was so like committed to structured gel. And I'd only done it in this class, but I knew I was like, this is it, like I was committed. But then I just, I, for me, I didn't see the point in JellX when a lot of my clients weren't getting the extension and I was doing all this work just to cut it down to like literally the very tip of their finger. they didn't want any length. Yeah. That was probably 80 percent of my clientele. And I was like why don't we just do the structure gel and you wait four weeks, your nails will grow out. And then we just maintain that shape. I also just because I didn't take, I didn't take a structure or a gel X class or anything. And, but I just some people were doing infills on them somewhere, I don't know. I just it got messy to me. I was like, wait I don't know if you can do this because that tip and so it just it became too There are too many steps and like it was too stressful to me To think like what could go wrong, especially with the listing.

Kristin: 11:13

Yeah,

Erin: 11:13

because with that experience I had with the greenie Like the whole Like, the whole tip that I put on had popped off because it's a unit, and so it just, it stressed me out. And like there, I'm not like trying to bash on people that love Jell x, like if you love Jell x, it's great. I'm glad it works for you. For me, I just I didn't like it. But I also, I was never an extension person. And I'm like dipping my toes in dual forms and that can be another podcast if you guys want. But I just have never been an extension person, so I think that's also why GelX just wasn't my thing. Yeah. And I

Kristin: 11:49

just, I don't know. I didn't, I stopped, so I actually was using that all the way up until the beginning of 2022. Okay. And that was before I moved to Tulsa. And at the time I was doing regular gel manicure, structured gel manicures, gel X and hard gel extensions. And because it's like, you want to be able to get as many clients as you can. Before I moved, I decided I wanted to take Paolo Ponce's, master gel nail course. And I took it. One of the parts of the class was she talked about downsizing your services and really becoming a specialist in a thing, that you really wanted to do. And my favorite thing was helping people grow out their natural nails. And so I really, so I had decided it was so stressful at the time too. I decided I was going to minimize my services. To just at the time, it was just gel overlays. I did add extension, like a, but I call it natural nail extension. Do with the forms. And I build with hard gel. I offer that to clients who are like nail biters and stuff like that, and typically like you want to say, Oh, like you'll grow your nails will grow, but a lot of people don't like where the nails at that point. And they really won't stop touching it until they have something on their nails. So I decided to add that. But still predominantly, I tell them the goal is to help your growth, your nail underneath grow out. That's what I'm known for. So having a service like gel X, where you're constantly soaking off did not align with what I wanted to be known for. Like I, what I wanted. To be my emphasis to be as a nail artist. And so I decided ultimately I let go of gel X and regular gel manicures. So those two I don't offer and I don't do regular nail polish, but that was really the reasoning why I let go of it. I have my own feelings about fills. And the only reason I have feelings about it is because I, like I said, I had started using it in 2017. The company came out in 2015. When they originally came out, they had said, we do not recommend fills. We recommend soaking off every time.

Erin: 14:12

So that was the other reason I forgot about that. That was the other reason I did not like gel X because I had to soak it off and The overuse of acetone was thinning out my client's nails. It does. It dries it out for

Kristin: 14:24

sure.

Erin: 14:25

Yes So when I found the stretch of gel, I didn't need to soak it off. I was like, I'm done I forgot about them soaking.

Kristin: 14:32

Then people kept pushing They want to do fills, teaches how to do fills. And I can remember the very first video that they put out. They distinctly said, we do not recommend doing this. We do not recommend doing fills on our products. However, if you're going to, this is how we recommend you doing it. And so I've even had like clients are like, Oh she would just do a fill. I just, don't know if I could ever get on board with that because in the beginning they distinctly said they don't recommend it. And I would rather stick to that because there's a reasoning for it. And I would rather just, whatever. And I know a lot of people get, have a lot of Positive results with it, but usually if company is telling you, they know their product better than anyone else. And if they're telling you, do this, I'm not going to do it. Then don't please don't do it. So that was a big part of reasoning. What was their reasoning? I think they couldn't promise that it would stay cause lifting holes, pockets, whatever. And again, like totally agree. So that was the thing is I don't want to keep soaking up a product. However, I still recommend it to some of my clients because one of the things that I said that I loved about it when it first came out was I wish I had this in high school. I did. I played soccer. Yeah. Did piano all those things. I couldn't have long nails, but I still had homecoming. I still have big events and I wanted pretty nails. So what I used to do was get acrylic and then I rip them off after because I could only keep them for a weekend or a week because I had to take them off because I was a goalkeeper. Could not have long nails. I wish I had this and I do recommend it to my clients who have daughters who want their nails done. I am not that client for you because mine is a continuous working on your nails, not a temporary. Nail service.

Erin: 16:20

I think that's how I sold it. Cause I was in a really small town. I was literally like a half a block away from high school. And that's how I would sell it to some of the moms or like some of the girls that came in. I'd be like, and I would just tell people, I'm like, it's a great product to, if you have an event, you can wear it and then you come back in. So often we'll do something else. You're not like married to it. Like I feel like you are, it's, I feel like acrylics are weird addiction.

Kristin: 16:46

I think there's, and I am really big when people like anytime I have clients who come in and they'll talk about Oh, this didn't work for me or whatever. I always say there is a place for everything. If people want two inch long Cardi B nails, acrylic is going to be your best friend. You're probably going to get the best wear out of it. Yeah. It's not going to be your friend if you're trying to grow out your natural nail and you want a bit of flexibility with the product. So I always say there's a place for everything. If you're somebody who only likes nails, when you go to Vegas, gel X is going to be your best friend, not acrylic and not me, not an overlay because I don't want to have to keep soaking it off. That is meant to be soaked off. Yeah. Like after aware,

Erin: 17:32

I feel like I should preface my comment about like acrylics being a weird addiction. I mean that by like my clients that like, Will come in after acrylics and like literally can't stop acrylics like that Like it's this crazy cycle of my clients with like short nails that like Want to keep going to get short acrylics and but then their nails are damaged and they're like Now I gotta put acrylics back on because my nails are damaged. It's no. Please come to me. Let me help you. Especially damaged healthy

Kristin: 17:59

damaged nails need something with more flexibility like gel. Any damaged nails in general are going to have a hard time having products last on it. We know that to be true. Yes. That is why I added The d and d service. It's not d and d. Why am I saying that? IBX Thank you. That's a nail company. IBX service. Because you're gonna get nail pickers, like that's just bound to happen. Yeah. So it's de there's definitely a place, I still recommend it to people. It's just not for me as a nail tech and what my goal is, like the type of clientele, right? If somebody is trying to get people to grow out. A hairstylist, like natural, like super healthy Kurt, like trying to help people restructure their curl. The last thing that they're going to do or recommend to people for that is to bleach their hair because you're going to lose your curl pattern. Especially if they've really dark hair. Speaking from experience. So and not saying that it's bad, I'm just saying it's what my goal is for clients as a nail tech, what I decided to emphasize in doesn't necessarily match with that as a thing. But I do like it. I will say it has definitely gotten more expensive than when it started. So I see a lot of nail techs with high prices for it. I think that it's, that's normal. The product is very expensive for getting a one where out of those tips, I'm looking it up

Erin: 19:21

now. I want to know, cause I think when I started, I can't remember how much the boxes, I want to say it was like 20. Yeah. Right now my internet is. Thinking real hard. Okay, except cookies. Okay. There's like the starter kit guy for 120. Just the tips. Just the tips. Just the tip. Oh, it's about 20. Let's see. Oh, it's 20. Okay. It definitely Oh, those are the ombre ones.

Kristin: 19:47

Cute. Okay. Okay. Oh, here we are. So the natural round long box of tips for six, with 600 pieces is 30. 30. Yeah. Yeah. So they've definitely gone up, but

Erin: 19:59

Oh, and the ombre one. So the natural ombre sculpted, it only has 210 and it's 20.

Kristin: 20:07

So you're probably going to be buying, to be fair, right? Let's say you just had one box. You're probably going through a whole box a month, but you're not going to buy just one box. You're going to have like different shapes and sizes of every shape. Yeah. And then you're going to use like four or five, six, seven. More often than any of their sizes. So then you're going to be buying refill bags of all of those. It adds up on top of the gel. I remember the gel being pricey too, not in a bad way. It's a good gel. I know people who just use it on its own, but you have to buy the gel. You have to buy the primer. That was the other thing. I think we've gotten a lot better, but when it first came out I had beef because it was like, so hard to try to figure out the best way to get this to last for a month. Yeah. And the company kept changing it too. What they recommended step by step and I get it. It's a, it was a new company. They were learning, they were figuring things out. I, yeah, it was, that was the biggest puzzle, but people love it and still do. It's blown up. It's incredibly successful of a company. I like them, but I would say, look to whatever you believe your, does it align with you as a nail artist and what you wanting to offer for your clients? Are you wanting to offer bold, glamorous? Showstopping nails, that you're going to go to Vegas for. And do you want to offer that in both temporary and permanent form? So like offering this with acrylic or this and hard gel, it's perfect. If you're a tip, like a nail tech like us, who is trying to work on the health of the nail and trying to be trying to touch the nail, the least amount as possible, that's one of the things that I promote, it's once I've buffed your nail, I'm. Not touching that part of the nail again. It's going to be covered by gel and grow out. That's not aligning with what I'm offering to my client. So I don't offer it.

Erin: 22:12

Yeah. And whatever you guys decide is your specialty or what you want to do is that's the right answer. Like you, there may be some of you that swear by acrylics or poly gel or dual forms or and you don't care for structured gel, and that's just. That's what makes it so cool that we're so versatile and there's so many clients that want every single, like they want those different options. So if you have a client, like you do gel X, but you have a client that doesn't want tips and that's okay, they're not the client for you recommend them to a nail tech that offers structured job. Like I have clients that don't want a detailed brush and manicure and I'm like, Hey, I'm not the tech for you because I'm not Discredit my service here. I'm not going to do less of what this service is And so here's some texts that do a more like a less. I don't know how to say it less Detailed or not a Russian manicure. They still do a E file manicure, but it's not as what word am I looking for? I don't know, there's a traditional American manicure. It is Monday morning. And we are feeling it. Like there's going to be nail techs for everybody and clients for everybody. And it's okay if you don't offer gel X or if you do, it's okay if you don't offer acrylics or you do, as long as Yeah. I don't either. I've had so many clients like, oh, are you going to do pedicures now? Cause I have the space.

Kristin: 23:40

I'm like, no, I don't have the space. And even if I did have the room in my studio, I don't have the time. I'm fully booked.

Erin: 23:47

So that's what I told one of my clients. And so I said, I don't want to take away from my clients to come in for. Manicures. Cause I love it so much. And if I offered pedicures, nobody would get in anyway. So I would invest in all this product and chair and all these things. And then I like, I wouldn't be able to do it. I'd probably do two people a month for pedicures and that's not worth it for me. And I don't want people to get excited about pedicures and not booked for manicures. They're upset that they can't get in for manicures. I'm upset because I can't touch fans. I have to touch feet all the time. So it's just not a thing and that's okay. And I prefer, To Olia for pedicures because she does dry pedicures and they're freaking immaculate and that's just what I do. I'm like, oh, I don't offer them, but here's the place I recommend. It's More high end it's gonna be a higher like expense, but it's worth it But I don't have a like wet pedicure place to recommend to people I just don't because I like I barely get pedicures I got one when we got married in September and that was last one I got, you know so it's just and even then I'm just like my eye is twitching and I'm Like freaking out because I know the horror stories of pedicures. So I just don't have, but I'm not going to do it. And that's okay. Nobody's mad at me. They're just like where do you recommend? I'm like,

Kristin: 25:06

there's also like a weird misconception that if we don't offer it, that we don't like it. I get so many clients who would say, Oh, do you not like doing pedicures? So no, I absolutely loved them, but I didn't have space for it. And now I'm fully booked. So I couldn't fit it in. Even if I got a bigger space. I didn't hate them. I didn't, they just

Erin: 25:26

weren't my favorite thing. Like I loved them, I loved it when I had the home salon and I was doing the dry pedicures. Those are fun. Yeah. But I just, I don't have the ability to purchase a really good, Like hydraulic pedicure chair or Oliya got Oliya. It's like a recliner from Walmart. It's like 400. And it has like the massage. And she like posted a video of her, like having a break. And I was like, wait, I want this just to sit in. And have a break. And I like went and it's like 400. I was like, I like, it's not a bad price, but I was like, I probably shouldn't be spending that. But I was like, Oh, I get to be like, Zach, look, honey, I got you a new recliner. Isn't it so

Kristin: 26:10

nice? It's going to stay in my studio. So

Erin: 26:13

yeah, it's going to be right here, but you can use it when I let you,

Kristin: 26:19

I will say, if you decide to do gel X, if you're listening to this, please make sure that you are. Pricing accordingly because the products are expensive. I think they are a great product. I don't think that they're for everyone. And if you have a client who's continuously coming in to like regularly get their nails done and stuff, try to steer them to a better Product, whether that be acrylic, hard gel or soft gel overlay. Just because, it can be rough to continuously, like it's a lot, but also you're losing money too. It takes a long time to keep looking off.

Erin: 26:56

Also take the classes. Like I just took a class this weekend. And if you guys follow me, like you'll see all the ombre posts I'm making. Like hyper fixating on it. But the class I took the ombre class, it was a Russian manicure class online with the ombre. And I took my Russian manicure class. We both did with Olia. Perfect nails USDA on Instagram. But I was like, Oh, I should take this and have a refresher. Cause it's been a year and a half since I took that class with her. And I also took a class with her and then was like out for six weeks because of my arm surgery. So it was good for me to have a refresher and get that muscle memory in there. But I took the class and learned new things, like new updated things that she may not have taught in that class because it was two years ago. So having a refresher and just like things changed, like the way that what I learned. In my Russian manicure class was slightly different of what Kristen learned in her Russian manicure class, because Olya is also getting better or things are changing and being added. So it's good to continue that education. It doesn't hurt to go over what you've already learned. So I learned new things and I forgot some things. So it was a good refresher, but I also learned the ombre. So even if you know how to do gel wax and you've watched YouTube videos and learned some other texts. Take that class because it's a good refresher. It's good validation that you're doing it correctly because it's coming from the company. And it just, you might learn something new or be like, Oh, I didn't think about that. That's a simple little thing. Like I learned how to hold my bit a different way on one of the sides of the nails. And I was like, Oh, that's really cool. And that could have been something only I taught me, but I like my brain it's gone, but continuing education is so good, even on stuff that you know how to do. Like I could sit and figure out how to do dual forums. I could watch YouTube videos, but I want to invest in the class to really know how to do it. So I'm doing it properly and structuring it properly for clients, but also to find out if I want to offer it to my clients. So continued ed is really good. Even I learned how to do like pigment powder ombre, but really wanted to learn how to do this. Yeah.

Kristin: 29:09

There's multiple ways to do things.

Erin: 29:10

So it's so easy. And then there's another class. I can't even think of her Instagram. We'll post it. There's another class coming. This nail tech is doing a I gotta find her Instagram. She's going to do an ombre class. And even though I just did an ombre class, I'm going to take hers because maybe she does it in a different way. That's even easier. It's sash gray. On Instagram, we'll post it, but she's going to do an ombre even though I already took an ombre class just because continuing education is fun. Yeah, I took a stamping class from her. Like I already know how to stamp, but I'm learning different things and how to like layer and like where to put things and like all these things. So take the gel X class, even if you No.

Kristin: 29:56

Yeah. I don't know. Talk about this a lot. I've taken a lot of classes, a lot of different people, a lot of different types, right? Like different forms of dry manicures, like multiple different kinds, different ways how to how to like different like with hardgel or soft structures. How you like put the bead down and how you decide to move it around the top of the nail, like multiple different ways to do it. There's no has to be this way or else. And what I've done is I've taken a little bit from this class that I've taken and then a little bit from this class and I've molded my way of doing it. So like the way that I do things is a little different than the way that you do things, even though we've taken a lot of similar classes. So It's great to continuously take classes, even on subjects that you've done before because of that, right? Because then you can find little tidbits here and there. And we always say it's the little details that can really take your service from good to great. Yeah.

Erin: 30:49

Even you see some videos and they'll text using a lint free wipes with alcohol to clean the nail plate. And then you see some people with those teeny tiny little Q tips, like those eyelash Q tip things to clean the nail plate. There's so many different ways or we use baby powder. Like we put baby powder on the nail and then brush it off before we use our Russian flame bit, because it helps just absorb that moisture and give like a cleaner finish and doesn't create as many micro tears. And I've just been using this tiny little bottle of baby powder. But I get my nails done from a nail tech in Lincoln, Becky Swaybella Nails on Instagram. And she uses this teeny tiny little bottle and she just taps it out and it just has the perfect little amount on each nail. So there's no wasted product and then it's controlled better. And I was like, wait a minute. Where did you buy these? And it's it has changed my life doing my manicure. Cause it's not as messy. There's not baby powder all over my gloves and like with me forever, my hands slipping, but like you learn from different people and then you find the way it works for you. Yeah. Just like Kristen said, like you learn all these different things. And I have a detailed brush, I swear by it. Olia uses a different detail brush, there's just some people love These liner brushes from Luxa, they just didn't work for me and that's okay. And I use one that's probably the, like the age of my entire business and I won't freaking throw it away, but I've learned to adapt to the weird curve and like sprouting off hairs and like all these things about the brush. But I like just replaced my brushes from, Shop my nail stuff. And I was like, Oh, I was fighting through it and didn't even know, but like we adapt to our environment and like we find little things that work for us that like somebody else may be like, Oh, I could never,

Kristin: 32:36

Can we get into, I've been waiting for this moment. I've

Erin: 32:41

been wait, I was waiting for you to bring it in. Cause it's your topic. So we're going to preface this with, I know nothing about this. So we yeah, I get to tell a story. This is my favorite part of our podcast is Kristen researches so well and knows so much more than me and I get to react and it's just my favorite thing because she gets to mic drop on me all the time.

Kristin: 33:04

It's really fun. I just, it's my weird neuro spicy thing, I think, and I just like learning. So yeah. And then I love that you listen to me. And I love that my clients always hear for you. So this, if people don't know a year ago, the, one of the co creators of the operate company, Carol Ma ended up posting a Tik TOK. She also posted it on her Instagram talking about how she was fired from her company. This is a true Steve Jobs story. If anybody doesn't know, Steve Jobs was fired from Apple, eventually brought back into it, but he was fired. The way that she tells the story, I'm not going to tell like everything because the story is pretty long, but if you want to Learn more about it. You can follow her on her Tik TOK or her Instagram. Her Instagram, I think is the same as her Tik TOK handle, but it's at conceded Carol. And so she talks, she has it posted. She posted this a year ago. It was like March of 2023. And it basically talks about how she was fired by her own company. And she was saying how this happened on April 22nd. She like shows like the letter email, whatever. But if you want an even more detailed, she gives like a three parter rushes through it really quick, but she goes through like a two hour podcast. She's on this podcast called the wealthy women podcast. It aired May 9th of last year, 2023. And she goes through the entire story. She talks about How she started a prey, how Jellix was created, how she got the industry to start using it. But then she also starts to talk about the downfall of what happened for her. And she said that April 8th. So things were already getting pretty I think uncomfortable. There was a lot of disagreement about where to move forward with the company about adding different things and stuff like that. So April 8th. Of 2022. She sat down for a sporadic meeting that they announced the night before we need to have a meeting with you. They basically bring up, I don't think we're on the same page anymore. And she agreed. She was like, it feels like we are going 10 steps forward, 15 steps back. They're in a disagreement about where the company needs to keep heading towards. She says in her Like in the podcast, she talks about how she wanted to expand so much more and she felt like everybody else and the people who the shareholders and stuff wanted to really keep a lot of it to themselves and keep the growth more intimate. And she said that she understood that, but she knew that the company could be much bigger than what it was. She said, ideally she wanted the whole company back. Because there was such a disagreement. I'm going to side note this really quick. We've seen this before and it's that the reason why she doesn't do it. I understand because it's very difficult. So a lot of people don't know that Facebook did a little bit of this too meta. They had a lot of shareholders basically having a say, okay, let me backtrack a little bit more. Business is hard. A lot of that is because We don't just have millions of dollars to start these companies. So nor it's normal to then try to get people to help financially investors, but always remember, and this is where it gets really difficult is the borrower is slave to the lender. I believe that to be true, and a lot of these troubles come from that. So Facebook had done that. A lot of the shareholders said, we need you to we need you to like, let go a bunch, like a whole bunch of people, blah, blah, blah. And we know that they had those big layoffs, but the layoffs would have been so much worse. If he hadn't tried, basically what he did was he bought back a bunch of those shares. And, but to do that, it took billions of dollars. And so that meant letting go of a lot of people to readjust the budgets. So when we saw those, like a bunch of like layoffs that played a huge part into it, but it was so that he could save, keep going the company the way that he wanted it. So she wanted to buy that, buy back her company, but that's a really tricky thing as we've seen with other people. So that's obviously not like an option, but what her dad wanted was for her to then was to leave Opry and make her own company. And she had said, I don't want to do that. I don't want to have to run a business going against my baby. I'm very angry about this. I know. I get it. It's going to be okay. People have emotional ties. It's like a Jellix was her baby. So what they offered her was that she could focus on the retail side, which is what she absolutely loved to do. So this is where it gets really crazy. They had November of 21. They had all talked as like a business that they were all going to go on vacation together, that they were going to go on a Disney cruise.

Erin: 38:05

Wait, so November 21, but she had this sit down meeting in May of 23. So May of 22.

Kristin: 38:12

No, sorry. April 8th of 2022 is when they had this before that. So jump back a few months before November of 2021, they had decided that they were going to all going to go on a vacation together because they were finally like making good money as a business. She has kids. Her co owner, co founder also has children and this whole thing. So they were going to do a Disney cruise. This is very important. So then that ha so they talked about doing that in November. They booked it. It was supposed to be for April of 2022. So April 8th of 2022, they have this meeting and she says, after the meeting, I'm so glad we could have this conversation before we go on vacation because I don't want it to be awkward. And they go, Oh, about that. We can't come shut the Yeah. Can you find a way to get our money back? Like we just can't leave the company right now because a lot of, it's really busy, but you're more than welcome to go on vacation. So she says, fine. She helps them get their money back, but she decides I already promised this to my kids. We're going to go. It's the first day of spring break for them. So we're going to head out. So April 2022nd, I've

Erin: 39:26

stopped breathing.

Kristin: 39:27

I know because this is like the big adjusted edge of my feet. April 2022nd. She's driving. They're prepping for, I don't know if she's on her way to the cruise or she's prepping to get to the cruise. I know it's right before they go on vacation. She gets a call from her best friend crying because she has been terminated. From the business. They just let her go. They did not tell they didn't tell her. They didn't tell Carol that they were going to let go of her friend. They did this without her knowing. So her friend then goes, you're next. They told me you're next. And she was, what are you talking about?

Erin: 40:02

She goes, I need you to check your

Kristin: 40:05

emails because when they fired me, they said that you were next. So they were going to talk to you next. So she checks her email while driving, right? This is right before the vacation with her family. And it's, it basically, she has a letter saying that they have voted her out. She's gone.

Erin: 40:20

What? Hey, have fun on this cruise that we planned. We're going to be back in a corner and hide behind a bush while we fire you. Yeah, we're not going to go to the happiest place on earth.

Kristin: 40:34

So one of the things that they had asked was You know, on the podcast. Why? Why do you think that this happened? So what she had brought up that she thinks was the trigger was because they hadn't really done an audit in the company because it's been so small over time, but she was deciding if they were going to start doing. Shifts in positions so that she would be head of the retail part of the business that she wanted to do an audit to check to see how the finances were and things like that. She said the moment after that, she brought it up. Everything had changed and she believes that was the trigger. So they wanted her out as fast as possible. So they basically did a vote. And if you don't know if like shareholders, the majority shareholders basically get the majority vote. And that's what happened with Steve jobs. That's why he got voted out was the people that, so when you invest in companies, you get shares when they hold shares, then get like a vote in the company. So in those majorities, if they have more, like if you, as the CEO has left less shares than the shareholders, As a whole own, and they all vote to have you out, you're out because they have more votes at the end. It's like a democracy. So their company was an S corp. And what people may not know is that with shareholders within an S corp. They pay taxes on that, but you're getting paid by the company. So typically you use a chunk of that money to pay off those taxes. But she says since receiving her last paycheck after being let go, she has not received a single penny. And she is at the time. I don't know what it is now because it's been about a year. She couldn't pay those taxes. And has defaulted on like hundreds of thousands. And then, it doesn't even end there. Two weeks after the cruise, they sue her.

Erin: 42:28

For what?

Kristin: 42:30

They say Sorry, I screamed. I know. So they say that she embezzled money. She stole money, like in that whole process. In that whole little family. I'm gonna assume that the lawsuit, Maybe could have been finished or is still continuously going. These type of things, even if there's no grounds on it can last for a really long time. So I'm not quite sure at this point where it stands, but the only, why am I bringing this up one? I like drama. It's funny. But a lot, I don't know. I care about kind of the morals of different companies and. I hate to be callous. This is business. This is how business runs. I don't necessarily like it, but it's in a really aggressive part of the industry. But some people obviously are going to maybe find that as cold and not want to support the company. A hundred percent. I understand. So what should what is your option? Carol ended up making her own brand. So she has her own brand of tips, which you can admit, we can know is probably absolutely identical since she was the founder of gel X.

Erin: 43:41

What is, what's her brand name?

Kristin: 43:43

It's called soft gel. S O F G E L soft gel. Now the Instagram handles and if you look at it, it looks pretty identical.

Erin: 43:54

Okay. I'm pulling it up. Go hurt. It does look identical.

Kristin: 43:58

So her dad ended up getting exactly what he wanted for her to start her own business. I know. I think they look really great. So if you're looking for another alternative, soft gel might be that packaging

Erin: 44:11

looks even

Kristin: 44:12

better. I have to agree. I actually, I love the photos on the website as well. Okay. I'm going, I haven't looked at the prices to be honest. I don't know. I'm pulling it up. Okay.

Erin: 44:24

Soft gel shop soft tips, full coverage. It is

Kristin: 44:29

cheaper by 10. It's at 20 for a box of 500.

Erin: 44:34

Nice. I like this packaging. Like the boxes are clear. The bottles are white and black. They look really nice.

Kristin: 44:46

You can also get the products. It looks like some of the really famous company or more popular, well known companies that are also selling them distributors is like nail Labo. I guess there's two California ones. There's nail Labo and there's Mitchie's nail supply, which I think is an actual store, but nail Labo does have a online website where you can buy it, or you can just buy it from soft gels website as well. They also have the typical pro registration. So I don't know if you could also get a discount on the already cheaper price. from what Opry is. But I wanted to throw that out there. I thought the story was really crazy. Highly recommend listening to the main story. I agree. If you want to listen to more of it. Like if

Erin: 45:24

I, if I knew that even without knowing that story, like looking at this Instagram, if I did JellX, I would switch to this. I think it's really nice. It just looks really nice and clean and really professional. I've never, I like before knowing any of this, I've never loved a praise. Like branding. I've never loved the look of the boxes and stuff, but if I compared these two, I would pick this. If I was just like a customer, just like scrolling on Instagram.

Kristin: 45:55

Yeah. And I think they look really nice. If you want to listen to more like the actual story, cause it's like a two hour podcast and I think her story is really interesting from beginning to end for operate. You can go on the wealthy women podcast and I think I said it before, but you'll scroll down and the episode was posted May 9th of 2023. And so you can listen to that podcast. I think it's really good. A really riveting story. There's a lot more detail, obviously a lot more drama than I can offer here. But I think you did a pretty good job.

Erin: 46:26

I adjusted. I was like squished back into my comfy couch and I like adjusted my whole body and gasped and stopped breathing and screamed. So I can't imagine I'm gonna have to listen to this podcast.

Kristin: 46:38

I had a feeling a lot of people Wouldn't have known about the story. Yeah. It had somehow fallen on my TikTok like a year ago. And when somebody had brought up to talk about JellX, I was like we can't do it without talking about this crazy story as well.

Erin: 46:52

Yeah. I'm glad you didn't tell me beforehand. Okay, cool. Because it just, it's great. I feel like I've. I am like a listener, like everybody else, I'm the first to hear it.

Kristin: 47:05

I think that's about it that I have to offer for Jell X. I think it was a good topic. It was a good topic. I like it. I know. We got a little bit of everything. We got business. We got talking about drama. It's riveting. It's

Erin: 47:20

riveting. The dogs are fired up about it. I would be too. They weren't terrible today.

Kristin: 47:26

This is like my time where I have like my notes. Look at that. I was so put together.

Erin: 47:31

I, yeah. I noticed you were reading. I was like, Oh, she came prepared. I sure did. No, don't be sorry. Nobody else can see us. It's just you and me. Smiles and notes. Proud mom.

Kristin: 47:44

But anyways. All right. So we're going to end it here. I'm really excited for Ness. Ness. Blah. I'm excited for next week as well. It is right before Cinco de Mayo. No, this is a good poster right after Cinco de Mayo. So everyone probably has a hangover listening to this, but good luck. Good luck. Aaron, where can they find

Erin: 48:03

you? Mangos underscore Manny's on Instagram. And I feel like I should preface it's not M A N G. Wow. M A N G O E S. It's like mangoes. Like I, like the mango owns the Manny. I've had so many people when I try to tell them my Instagram, they're like, Oh, like mangoes. I'm like, no mangoes, Manny. I don't, you'll find it. Yes. So sorry. Where can they find you Kristen?

Kristin: 48:33

They can find me at black Dahlia nails, black underscore Dahlia underscore nails. And you can find both of us together for the podcast at C curve podcast. And until next time, keep making beautiful nail art. Bye. Bye.

48:50

Bye.